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    • #109643
      Balloons
      Participant

      hi, I was just wondering if anyone on here would mind sharing how much contact their children had with their ex? My ex was emotionally abusive and controlling, not physical. Sometimes I think he is manipulating the children and using them to get at me, and I worry about the time they currently have with him and that I should reduce it, but I also wanted to hear of anyone had significant contact and if it was okay? Or if they felt it should have been less? I know everyone’s experience will be different somewhat, but anything you can share would be really appreciated. Thank you xxxx

    • #109786
      Balloons
      Participant

      Just another question to chuck in here… I’ve heard about sending a book between houses to give important information about the children (how they slept, what they ate, favourite shows/games/toys etc) but my gut tells me this is a bad idea with him. I feel that he wouldn’t be honest about the time the children are with him, and he would use whatever I put in there against me (like, oh they didn’t eat their dinner? They always eat dinner with me!) and so on. It just feels like opening up a way for him to communicate with me and makes me uncomfortable. But I’m not sure if I’m blowing it out of proportion, or if anyone else has experience doing something similar and if it worked okay for them (or not!)?

    • #109976
      Balloons
      Participant

      Bump x

    • #110069
      Balloons
      Participant

      Hi again everyone, I don’t mean to pester anyone and I know that everyone is going through there own stuff, and I feel silly for even asking given what some of you are dealing with right now.. i just wondered if there is anyone that is through the other side that could help me out? I’m currently dealing with courts and cafcass and I seem to spend every moment i get on here or reading books, and the more I educate myself the more I’m not sure about the level of contact.. what if its damaging them? I know I won’t get no contact, but i suppose I’ve just been freaking out about the whole thing. Its taken me a long time to even recognise his behaviour towards me, let alone knowing what is best for the children.. I’ve never done any of this before!

    • #110081
      Lisa
      Main Moderator

      Hi Balloons

      I just wanted to show you some support. I know you are a really good mum and trying to do what is best for your children.

      You may not get many replies to this post as we are not able to share details about experiences of on-going court procedures. The reason for this is that it could be identifying and may jeopardise any further investigations or court proceedings.

      Rights of Women have lots of useful information on their website and they have a helpline where they can give free legal advice. The Coram Children’s Legal Centre can also give you some legal advice or your local domestic abuse service can signpost you to local solicitors.

      You could also have a chat to a Women’s Aid worker in confidence via our Live Chat service (weekdays 10am – 4pm and 10am – 12pm weekends). They won’t tell you what to do, but can discuss your situation and signpost you to other support that’s relevant for you. You can access the chat service here: https://chat.womensaid.org.uk/

      Take care and please keep posting

      Lisa

    • #110083
      Wants To Help
      Participant

      Hi Balloons,

      I’ve not been on here for a while but I’ll share mine with you.

      I had a temporary residency order in place for the whole process of the court stuff, which was longer than one year and less than three years! Times get taken out on here and sometimes timescales are important so people can gauge things, but anyway, it was in place for a long time!

      The court decided on the contact my ex would have from the start, which was for two hours every (detail removed by moderator), and alternate weekends from (detail removed by moderator) and the next weekend (detail removed by moderator). So for a long time, I never had a Saturday with my son. At the time, I wasn’t working, so I did have my son 24/7 for the rest of the week, and I had him for a Sunday every other week.

      My ex would pick my son up (detail removed by moderator) on a Friday so that we didn’t have to deal with each other that day, and on the other occasions we used a (detail removed by moderator) car park to do the handovers.

      There were occasions like birthdays and Father’s Day, grandparent visits, that I would allow my ex extra time with our son, but my solicitor soon put a stop to this and informed me that I was also breaching the court order by going outside of the legal agreement, and that extra contact could go against me in the overall outcome, so I had to take this advice on board. Of course, this was me being fair and trying to do ‘the right thing’ but he never reciprocated and ended up having our son one Mother’s Day and not considering me. So, my advice to you would be to try to come to an arrangement you are happy with and accept that in the first few years there is likely to be no flexibility at all.

      • #110088
        Balloons
        Participant

        thank you wants to help. That sounds hard, and like he got a lot more contact than I would hope for.. im also a bit worried that maybe Lisa was right and in asking this question I may have caused you to write things that might be identifying for you? I’m worrying now.. but thank you for taking the time to share your story.. I do have a couple more questions for you but will pm you later x*x

    • #110085
      Balloons
      Participant

      Thank you Lisa. Just to clarify, I’m not really looking for people’s experiences of court, I just wondered if anyone had experience of 50-50 parenting and if they found it to be manageable or if they had any regrets.. sometimes it seems like my children have a nice time with their father but then sometimes they tell me things that concern me and I’m not too sure what to do. Its nothing extreme, just warning signs of his old behaviours coming up. Oh and if anyone tried things like using a book to go between households.. as this is something else I’m reluctant to do but maybe I’m just being overly paranoid? If there is anyone with any experience of these things then I’d really appreciate hearing from you… I suppose I only mentioned court because that is whats causing me so much anxiety right now.. I will do my best to not talk about it on here x

      • #110093
        Wants To Help
        Participant

        You’re welcome, and don’t worry, my abuser would never think to read this forum, he won’t recognise me on here!

    • #110091
      Anonymous
      Inactive

      Hi Balloons

      I can’t really help you with the whole 50/50 thing and fortunately I’m not married to my abuser, so my circumstances are quite different. I do know that just the thought of court does petrify you.

      When your children reach a certain age, cafcass and the court will take into consideration their feelings too and if he tries to alienate you in anyway then contact could be stopped in anyway. If you ever have doubts in the future you should inform the court straight away.

      Maybe you should think about what contact would suit your children, start off little and see how that goes. If the courts think you’re being reasonable then they won’t order too much to soon and it will always be in the best interests of the child/children. Age etc will also be big factor.

      Your anxiety is normal and you can rant to me if you like. Lol xx

    • #110092
      Anonymous
      Inactive

      Also Balloons you should tell cafcass of any concerns you may have regarding previous emotional abuse as it will be recorded then and the court can see any risk factors to take into consideration when making an order. You ex may or may not continue to abuse you through your children or try and turn them against you. This is called parental alienation and this is abuse and taken very seriously by the family courts. I hope it doesnt get to this stage for you, but just be prepared that your ex could go that low. X

      • #111053
        Balloons
        Participant

        Thanks turtledove. He does already subtly do this, but my worry is more that he is accusing me of it. He says I’m emotionally abusive and that I’m the perpetrator of parental alienation, but I’m just hoping the truth will be enough and he will trip himself up somewhere. My children are too young to be spoken to by cafcass so it will fall to me to get my concerns across. I know I have a bit of a battle on my hands as I have allowed contact for a fair amount of time and now I want to reduce it.. will just have to try my best. Xx

    • #110892

      Hello Balloons,
      My first time posting on here, but I read your post and really wanted to share a few things which I hope may be helpful….maybe not!
      My ex was very psychologically and emotionally controlling, but not physically. My child has almost 50/50 daytime with their father, though more nights with me, decided by a Judge in court. I would much prefer it to be less but, for a number of reasons, that’s what I’ve ended up with.
      I have heard people say children should always try and have contact with their father, and that a rubbish dad is better than no dad, that more contact is better so that they can have a meaningful relationship with the child/ren, but I think it’s different in the context of abuse. The courts don’t seem to always be able to tell the difference though. I do think kids should be able to see their dad if it’s safe for them and they can decide when they’re older what they want, but I also think it is important for the child/ren to be protected from potential abuse and having less time with him limits the opportunities he has for playing mind games/manipulating/controlling the child/ren. I also think it’s important for us to trust our gut, and that we know what’s best for our kids. Limiting his harmful effects on them as much as we can I think is what is best for our children in the long run, so they can grow up to be emotionally healthy. And, as we can’t control what he’s doing with them, to make sure that when they are with us, we give them security and love, so they know they can rely on us, even if their dad is being a p**t. They then get the antidote from us to what he is trying to have them believe.
      You might also be interested to know Balloons, I have been advised by social services and children workers to keep a log of everything that happens and I do that in a little book I have, so if anything major does happen, I have details of previous things.
      I have cut almost all communication with my ex and others help me with handovers but I do use a handover book, as I find this a really effective way of limiting his opportunities for manipulation and means I can have more control over when I hear from him and when I don’t so I don’t have to deal with him all the time. We both write in it and it goes with my child at handovers. If you do go for a handover book, I would strongly recommend a structured one rather than just a plain notebook so it has specific sized spaces for comments, and to write a few essential things rather than what they’ve had for breakfast/favourite things etc. My ex already knows my child’s routine/allergies etc. so I choose 3 or 4 things to write a short sentence about, including sometimes responding to a comment he’s made if he actually needs to know. I’ve found ‘yellow rock’ to be very helpful with this (you can find it online)– it’s a method to help deal with a n********t in child custody, thought about in the context of court proceedings, but I think works well in any situation – just the idea that you are writing whatever you write for the someone who may look in one day, rather than your kid’s father. I’ve used a more detailed handover book before with more space and sections to write things in but found it gave him too many opportunities to try and control me so switched to one with less space to write and have found it so much easier…it just limits the amount of things he can say…..though he does frequently write more!
      Sorry this is so long….I just wanted to get everything in there and I hope at least some of it is helpful to you. I know when people have shared their experiences with me it has really helped to know I have options and am not alone! Love x

      • #111054
        Balloons
        Participant

        Hi we all have beautiful minds, thank you for your response, not too long at all and really helpful. And I feel honored i was your first post!! Can I ask what book you use? I would like to look into this because the lack of communication between households is really difficult. It sounds like a good idea to use something that limits the information because I know that he would just see it as another opportunity to rant (he loves the sound of his own voice, even if its just written down!).

        That must be hard doing 50 50 when its not what you believe to be best, but i hear what you’re saying about remaining steady and a good influence for the children. Im preparing myself for this outcome, and know I will just be there to support them no matter what. The more I read and learn the more I feel like the courts are not inline with the affects of abuse and how this can continue to affect children post separation.. i just hope whoever I get to speak to from cafcass is somewhat clued up.

    • #110900
      fizzylem
      Participant

      Guess legally he is eligible to go for 50/50, but for me, I learnt that she needs some regular time and consistant care with her dad. I learnt that he seems to have a better chance at delivering this with short, frequent bursts, it’s when he has her for longer periods that the problems start, because he drags her round with him and into his adult world. So, to get this has been a battle, raising concerns when he’s neglected her or when he’s been emotionally abusive to her or simply when he’s been a shoddy parent. I used to tackle this myself, nowadays I get other agencies to do this for me. Cafcass did pick this all up as well, through what I said, but more so what she said, so I guess it depends if your child is old enough to verbalise themselves as well – as this helps a great deal. Unfortunately they can be manipulated ‘at the time of their interview’ if they young. Another reason why mum needs to fight for the least time if this happens.

      I have noticed, over the years, that it is always better for her when she has some kind of OK functioning relationship with him, that when she has a difficulty with him it helps if she can have a time out and we can find a way to overcome this. He has taught her how to be forgiving for sure; but sadly, until recently, too often to put his needs first and it’s better to keep quiet, which robs her of self acceptance and self esteem, leaves her feeling unimportant and little self worth. I’ve also had years of challenging angry behaviour to deal with – which I think would have been much worse had she spent more time with him.

      So, when things are OK, and they can only be ok at best really, she feels good about herself and the world, but when she is upset and thus opts out of the relationship for a time, she can feel abandoned, unwanted, unloved and she does not have the emotional awareness to see these feeling stem from how she feels in relation to her father – so it spills into self loathing and everyone hates me – heartbreaking when this has happened for sure.

      So, I have kept time to the minimum because of this and I don’t regret this at all; I would suggest if you feel that he is a poor influence in every fibre of your being, try to keep contact, short, regular and sweet – ideally with an exit strategy for the child if he/she needs it if this is possible; kind of helps the child just by knowing what this is – maybe ask cafcass for suggestions re this.

      You are the primary carer, so I would fight to hold on to as much of this power as you can – meaning dont agree to anything you don’t really need to – that you may later regret when he holds you to it – video calls are a good example – has to be a no no (better if it’s child led, say he buys a device and you say when X asks to speak with dad I will assist – rather than agreeing to set times 3 times a week – utter ballache for you, and for the child really; it also gives him ordered access into your home – no).

      Personally, I feel it’s better to start from a position of little, with room for more if this works for the child. If you have the power to say yes the child can stay for longer, this is great, if he has this power too, he will only manipulate the child, so the way to keep your power to do this and keep the child protected is to not give him this power too – so to go for less – if that makes sense, with power comes great responsibilty, I can work with this, see what is right and fair by him and my child and act achordingly, unfortuanetly he can’t do this, he only uses his power for abuse and to try and cause distress. Never because what it this is what the child needs.

      I would say always go for what is best for your child, always have integrity in everything you do and it should turn out right. This does not mean bending over backwards for him to keep the peace, or to appear as reasonable to cafcass, it means it works for you as well, it may mean sometimes its works less for you but is best for your child but manageable – it always has to feel manageble. Your power is in acknowledging you can not deal with him alone really; he will get access to his child, but he does not have the right to continue to abuse you through this contact; third party comms and handovers is always best with these men, and cafcass will support this if you can show there is a need and how this is better for the child.

      Cafcass will listen to you; I wouldn’t say out loud you think less time is best because he is a selfish / an abuser / rubbish dad, rather something like it seems to work better for them both when it is shorter bursts of time because of X, Y and Z or something like, show don’t tell (with examples) is a good rule of thumb. Good luck x

      • #111055
        Balloons
        Participant

        thank you fizzylem, all very good points. Unfortunately my children are too young to be spoken to by cafcass, so it will just be my word and his (and he’s going all out in his counter accusations). I totally get what youre saying about video calls etc, and will bare that in mind too. If I can aim for less then I will. Thank you again x

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