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    • #21862
      Herindoors
      Participant

      I read this article with interest today https://www.theguardian.com/society/2016/jul/14/programme-aims-to-help-people-affected-by-parental-alienation

      This line particularly struck me ‘creating the impression that the targeted parent does not love the child or is dangerous

      When he was gone I was very careful to stay neutral with my child (older teenager) when talking about him. She saw him regularly at first and then his true behaviour came out, there was an incident that disturbed her, and she stopped seeing him. After that I would still be neutral, over time say that maybe he had got help and changed somewhat and kept asking her if she wanted to see him again. I thought I was doing the right thing. She was always reluctant to committ either way. Further down the line I started seeing my counsellor and talked this through with her. She pointed out to me that emotionally my child was still a child and maybe I needed to be more honest about what I really thought.

      So I was. We both already knew he is a n********t. So I told her that his basic behaviour would never change and she would have to accept that and think about what relationship she could have with him and have very distinct boundaries. She then admitted she didn’t want to see him and would decide when she felt it was right. Could be 6 months or 6 years.

      During this time my ex was accusing me of parental alienation. Telling me that I should be encouraging her to see him, telling her how much he loved her, admitting to her that half the marriage breakdown was my fault (I know!) and that what he did was not really abuse etc…

      For a good few months now we have heard nothing directly from him, the odd message passed on by a family member. I bet if someone asked him why he would blame our child for not contacting him first and me for not ‘making’ her.

      It’s that line above that worries me though. In normal circumstances (normal people) it applies but with an abuser it is actually true and I wonder how many ‘experts’ understand this?

    • #21868
      Serenity
      Participant

      So interesting to read your post.

      I too have tried to remain neutral- regarding their relationship with him- but they knows my stance, as I am no contact.

      My hope is that they will find their own truth.

      If I try to force feed them the truth I fear it will backfire.

      However, interestingly both my counsellor and family members suggest that I am more vocal about my opinions towards him.

      So I have allowed myself the odd slip up. They know my view- that he isn’t kind. I hope this stops them from blaming themselves when he is horrible to them.

    • #21894
      Ayanna
      Participant

      PAS is a recognised condition and there are countries that take legal action against parents who actively pursue this, such as the UK.
      As a matter of fact it is true that some parents deliberately alienate the child from the other partner and they become completely estranged and loose all contacts. The father’s movement goes on about this all the time and there is a petition to the UN about this too.
      I have a case in my family where this happened.
      It is sometimes very difficult to decide whether the child’s guardian does this out of spite and hatred or whether there are genuine concerns about the child’s safety.
      Some countries prefer the alienation because the single parents are easier to handle than parents who have a battle with an ex partner. The losers are the children in this.
      In my opinion PAS is justified when one partner is abusive and dangerous and should be pursued in such a case.

    • #21902
      SilkyHalide
      Participant

      I’m really torn on this. As an alienated mother and knowing others I fear that we too often are ignored and discredited by the alienating parent. However if things reversed I don’t know how to approach it. If my ex upset the children and they told me they didn’t want to see him would I support them and thus alienate him instead or would I be firm they can’t just run away because they don’t want to follow rules. I think I would take the risk of alienating him and not because I want revenge but because I invalidated my children’s concerns too many times before. I’ll not push them back into that trap.
      I’ve broken free I can’t prevent them from doing that too.

    • #21976
      Peaceful Pig
      Participant

      Just a thought but maybe in cases where fathers are known to be abusive the authorities and courts should be making sound, evidence-based decisions which protect children from them instead of allowing unsafe contact and leaving mothers with an impossible choice they can’t win.

    • #21991
      Twisted Sister
      Participant

      its a worry to think that before the necessary laws and protections are properly in place for women and children, there is already such a force and common use of this to attack back which again undermines the protection that mothers can give their children by pointing out wrong behaviours and helping them deal with them.

      I think itsa fine line, but isn’t it the same as wanting someone to point out if we were being unreasonable or unfair to them? Is it alienation to state the things that are abusive? Seems we can’t do right for doing wrong all the time?

      pointing out abusive behaviours amongst others, and setting boundaries around the children isn’t alienation but how easily can it be perceived as that… scarey!

      I was told that i was protecting him, because i didn’t say what he’d done, but i thought i was protecting the children, but i see now that by keeping silent and not helping them to see him for who he was i was in fact protecting him and making it more difficult for them to see the reality of their father and who he really is.

    • #21992
      Ayanna
      Participant

      I find it interesting how different cultures can be. PAS as it is happens when one partner leaves the relationship and turns the children against the partner whom they leave in order to get back at this person.
      Where I am from women use this strategy when they cannot get the financial benefits out of a relationship as they had originally thought. Or they find another man and betray the husband with that man. It is a strategy mainly used by women where I am from.
      Here in the UK PAS seems to be used as another form of abuse by already abusive men.

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