Sexist Dating coach advice and the 'trad wives' trend

[SunshineRainflower]

Back when I was online dating years ago I remember reading quite a few blogs and articles about dos and don’ts of dating. It would be after typing something like ‘how to work out if he’s a player’ into google. Some of the advice I found online was good, such as red flags to watch out for and it helped me dodge some bad apples. But after years of dating on and off and reading this advice and listening to it to a certain extent although never entirely, it all contributed to me becoming extremely depressed again. I stopped reading that stuff before my ex and stopped dating after him because I felt the whole world of online dating and the advice of these coaches was so incredibly depressing I couldn’t be in that world and keep my sanity and peace of mind.

Because of being asked out on a date recently these sites have come up again after I did a google search when I was trying to decide what to do. I started reading some again and already it’s giving me that uneasy heavy depressed feeling. I’ve never analysed it much before but thought it might help to share about it here.

I notice that almost all of these dating coaches, whether they are male or female, have a 1950’s view of men and women where they tell women we need to be feminine, confident but not loud, classy but neither frigid nor slutty, we need to have a career but not be too bossy and domineering or earn too much in case it makes him feel insecure. We need to be young and slim and have perfect skin/hair/face/clothes/body at all times. There’s this horrible undertone of ‘if you’re single it’s all your fault but you might be able to find someone if you change everything about yourself and do everything I say.’ Basically, if you followed all of their advice you’d be a sort of 1950s doll and once married you’d be a 1950s housewife doll who must never ‘nag’ or ‘complain’ and must always ‘put your husband first’ and basically blame yourself for anything going wrong in the relationship even though he’s done something cruel/insensitive/abusive.

I found myself absorbing some of this stuff subconsciously and remember panicking a lot about my age because these people are always going on about women’s age as if you should be ashamed of yourself for ageing. I made sure I was slim and looked nice and suppressed my true personality in case it was unappealing. I remember distinctly thinking I can’t let them know that I absolutely love cats, because of the ‘crazy cat lady’ cliche. I did attract men and went on quite a lot of dates. Some of the men were pleasant enough, smartly dressed, had decent jobs, were polite and respectful etc. But, I never clicked with any of them or enjoyed the dates. All of these dates made me feel depressed and the reason was because I didn’t click with any of them, no doubt because was suppressing who I really am so I knew the men were interested in me because I was presenting as a non descript doll ie. they didn’t know the real me.

I stopped dating for a few years and tried it again with a new profile, this time I was more feminist and showed my hobbies and dressed more casually in my pictures. I hoped this would attract similar men but for some reason it attracted even worse men. I briefly dated two of them and one was my abusive ex, whilst the other was a guy who literally asked me to get up off the sofa after a date at his house to do his washing up!!!! Ie, a total sexist pig who wanted a mother/domestic slave for a partner.

I’ve been reassessing my decision not to date and if I’m honest, I would really like a partner, although I still don’t consider myself ready to date at the moment. It’s got me thinking though, what do I do when I want to date again? It just feels like a lose lose situation. Follow the dating coach advice and attract men who want gormless dolls who basically use you as a housewife and a masturbatory aid, or just be yourself and stop attracting anyone/only attract abusers and weirdos? I keep thinking of all the women in the world who have decent husbands who respect and love them and I think, where and how did they find them? I can’t imagine they followed some advice of some critical sexist coach.

I’m also thinking with unease that this type of advice is contributing to domestic abuse, because it teaches men to be manipulative and controlling and to view women as objects, and women to be passive and suppress their own wants and needs. There is a growing community online I read about called ‘Trad Wives’ (traditional wives) who are women who want to go back to a 1950’s lifestyle where they are housewives and don’t work and put their husband before everything including even their children. I think it’s fine to be a housewife if that makes you happy but a lot of their community worries me, such as the way they downplay domestic abuse and think it’s ok for men to control their wives.

Did/do any of you read dating coach blogs/advice? Do you think they have any value or do you think they are nonsense, possibly even dangerous nonsense? What do you think about the trad wives trend?

[fizzylem]

I read an article yesterday in a tabloid, wouldn’t usually read a paper but was in a cafe and it was on the table, was a lovely story about 3 women living togther after divorce, they were having a blast and said that through this support, emotional and financial, they were able to live life to the full.

I could see how this type of living could be much better for the elderley as well in the future – if we were to pool our resources; could beat isolation – there are so many good reasons really – would require a huge shift in thinking though wouldn’t it. Being old in the UK is not something anyone looks forward to is it, unless you are wealthy and well supported, infact it’s feared – so this needs to change – our final chapter should be enjoyed as much as the rest – we’re a nation with fingers crossed here at present and doing NOTHING about it. Perhaps if we could the end of life phase right for folk the rest of life would be shaped in ways that better meet our needs from begining to end?

I think we tend to think it’s a him or I’m destined to be alone, that these are the only two options; infact abusers tend to exploit this fear don’t they telling us ‘you’ll never find anyone else to put up with you’.

For me like you, it’s about asking what do I really want here, and when I think about this I can see that I can do all these things and meet my needs in a number of ways, through many, that it doesn’t need to be with one man and a committment to him.

For example, when in my twenties I did a lot of travelling, sometimes with some girl friends but at other times alone, met some really interesting folk along the way; in fact being a lone traveller probably motivated me more to mingle and strike up conversations with others, so, I don’t see being alone as a barrier to travel. There are now plenty of companies who sell the lone traveller experience so you know everyone is in the same boat; I actually really like the freedom this brings – no compromises, can go where and with who I like at anytime and when I’m done socialising I go to bed – and strecth out! Sleep well.

Laughter, emotional and practical support, exercise and creativity, spirituality, love, joy, appreciation, stimulation and curiosity, fun – can all be met through my friends, family and pets.

It would be nice to meet someone kind and respectful, who shares similar values and interests yes; but I take the passive view, if it happens then great and if not, great too. I also understand it is highly likely I won’t meet someone this way as well though – possible but unlikely.

I find it complicates things being with a man, so he’d have to be right, we’d need to find a good patter, because being with someone is to give, not sure I’d want to anymore, more interested in trying to achieve my goals, get a lovely home, being financially secure with the lifestyle I want. It’s not really about having one person to share this with for me, it’s about having lots of people to share it with.

Would like someone to lean on now and again – but then I can always sort out what it is that needs doing – as I have support and I know where to go or who to ask when I dont know what to do – so I can sort most things; my fiends and family leave me feeling cared for and I also care for them.

When I’ve looked at some of these sites you’ve mentioned, the men (and most of the women too actually), seem to want her to be ambitious, successful, healthy, without children or want them and financially independant, and I’ve been struck at how many men say they are looking for women 10 years younger too, which is a huge turn off for me; they appear to want it all; and I am none of these things really. I have to work on keeping myself healthy every day, because I don’t have the best health, I’m happy to earn enough, I value my time and experiences over money and stuff. I’m currently on benefits and probably will be for a very long time yet – may always need some kind of state support? Doesn’t make me a scumbag does it, in fact, like you, I have a lot to offer and it is probably in part that because of this state support I am able to give this to others – when I feel able and choose to.

I like that if I dont want to cook I can grab a sandwich, eat when I’m ready; leave my mess out if I want, wake and decide what am I doing today, potter and please myself. So, if there is ever a him he will need to accept me for who I am and where I am – and I will offer the same. However, I don’t think I’ll ever need to make a committment to him again unless we both wanted this; I’m certainly never going to give up my home ever again for anyone.

Thinking it would have to feel non intrusive, always respectful and fun, and all disagreements to be resolved through discussion only. I have absolutely no desire for any conflict ever again and if I am met with this it would be a deal breaker – have come to see and learn there is never any real need for it – so this is what I’d be open to exploring – a relationship ‘like all the others I already have’ and if that develops and we get closer – lovely, I’ll roll with it, but I’d need to know him inside and out as a friend first; means I am always free to walk away as well if I need to hey; I am in no rush to call anyone mine or be his, and I can’t see this ever changing now – as I don’t see or feel the need anymore. It’s either great or I’m not spending time with this person x

[Newst@rt]

Love this KIP, something to aspire too. I was going to say (although not as eloquently) that perhaps it would be better to get on with your life, be you, and see what you attract? x

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