Should I give him a chance?

[Lovethesea]

I’m new to this not sure what to do because the abuse has only just started and I do really believe that he wants to change this that he wants to stop. He doesn’t blame me he says it’s him and he’s ashamed of what he does and he’s sorry. (detail removed by moderator). It’s like he has this anger in him he didn’t have before and he gets annoyed about everything I do and then sometimes he gets angry about it. He criticises me all the time puts me down and has said the most hurtful things some he doesn’t remember because he was drunk. He only drinks at weekends because he works hard all week but before this he was lovely when he was drunk. He used to be a sweet loving gentle man. We had arguments sometimes but never really bad and we would make up quickly, we hardly ever shouted at each other we would try to sort things out calmly and we have never once argued at home so my kids don’t ever see or hear it, they are teens. But he changed so much after his (detail removed by moderator) funeral (detail removed by moderator) he changed and became angry and it’s as if he lost that empathy and kindness he had before. I told him that if the abuse didn’t stop Id end it and he would have to move out and he stopped it for a while but when he did it again I decided it was over and I have been asking him to leave since then so about a month or two now. (detail removed by moderator) I had just sent him messages in the morning telling him he has to move out and I wasn’t changing my mind. I’ll continue in the comments because it’s so long.

[Lovethesea]

(detail removed by moderator), something in me snapped and I lashed out at him hitting him on his chest not hard because I was driving and I’m very small and petite and he’s a strong muscular guy so it didn’t hurt him at all. But it made him very angry and he grabbed my hand and squeezed it really hard and didn’t let go, (detail removed by moderator) It was so painful and my hand was too and I was screaming at him to let go. (detail removed by moderator). The next day he sent me messages saying he was sorry it was nasty and he was ashamed about it and he knows it’s wrong and how horrible it must be for me. I said sorry for hitting him too. But I made it clear we were not together still and he has to move out that’s it’s not working anymore. He has ignored that and just carries on as normal which is what he always does because he doesn’t want to leave. I’ve been thinking about what happened and that it was traumatic for me but then I think what he went through as a child (detail removed by moderator) and I know he has never delt with this trauma. He’s talked to me about it but that’s not enough and I am sure this is why he is behaving this way now his (detail removed by moderator) has gone all the all the pain is coming out. So should I support him through this and make him get proper help or do I just make him leave. Can someone who wants to stop actually stop this kind of behaviour? I would prefer him to leave and us stay friends and still support him because it’s not something I want to live with anymore. I just don’t know what to do. Thanks for listening.

[maddog]

Lovethesea, it sounds horrific.

No, you absolutely can’t be there for him while he ‘sorts it out’. He won’t. He’s told you about some of the dreadful things that happened to him when he was little. He’s effectively told you that his behaviour isn’t his fault. He’s already shifted the blame onto someone else. He’s already done that to you as well.

He’s shown you that he’s a lot physically stronger than you, and that he’s prepared to attack you while you’re driving. It sounds dangerous.

Of course he’s going to blether away and feel sorry for himself. He’s going to try to hoover you back up and make it hard for you to leave him.

He isn’t going to change and even if personality transplants were a thing, you’re not the person to stand by his side. Dealing with these people is very specialist, and certainly not something you can live with day to day.

As you look back, you may start seeing the red flags in the relationship and start to recognise that it wasn’t all sweetness and light.

Really try not to respond to his communication. Ultimately you’ll just become more confused and shredded. While you don’t respond, you may find that his communication becomes increasingly desperate and angry. Nothing you say or do is going to make him better. As he’s told you, the damage took place long before you came along.

When terrible things happen in childhood, a way to cope is to build a false self, a different person who isn’t really a person at all. These abusers are like the Invisible Man, constructed out of the characteristics of other people, hence the mirroring and acquisition of personality traits. There’s nothing there beneath the veneer.

His behaviour will become worse. Please work towards your own safety. Baby steps

[Lovethesea]

He’s not told me those things from his childhood to put blame on it. He told me them a long time ago and he wasn’t abusive in any way back then and it was him opening up to me because that’s actually something he needs to do to heal from it. I’m someone who he felt safe to do that with. Why is his trauma ok but mine isn’t. He was a child who was abused worse than I have been. If he did open up more I think things would be better but since his (detail removed by moderator) funeral he has not mentioned it he’s not cried. He has never blamed his behaviour on his childhood or his (detail removed by moderator) he takes the blame himself he knows it’s his fault. He’s not anything like you say he is. He doesn’t play the victim to make me feel sorry for him. He does hide how he feels and what he is going through because he is man pretending he can do it himself when he can’t. I am not excusing his behaviour I know it’s abuse.

[Lovethesea]

I just feel that no one gives any man a chance to change. I don’t know if he will. I know there are some abusers who won’t change and don’t want to and some are very dangerous and controlling but he is not like those men he’s not controlling at all. He has never tried to control me we’ve always been equal in this relationship and if I don’t want to do something or I want to do something and he isn’t happy about it he doesn’t stop me and same with me. I’ve never felt scared of him and i told him if he says anything abusive to me again I will do that again because I’ll be angry and he better not try to stop me he can shout at me to stop but not use his hands. I do stand up to him. (detail removed by moderator). I could see his (detail removed by moderator) pain because of what he’d done to them. It made me see things differently that even a man who was once so brutal could have that love in him. He had been severely abused by his (detail removed by moderator) and that’s how the cycle continues in each generation until someone stops doing it.

[Hereforhelp]

Hi, I didn’t want to read and run…. I gave my abusive husband (who also had an abusive childhood, he would also claim to be sorry)… I remained for over 2 decades believing Hi would change

It is entirely on your husband to get help, does he get abusive to people at work? Or friends and other family members or does he save it only for you?

Keep posting ❤️ HFH

[Lovethesea]

He’s not my husband we’ve been together for (detail removed by Moderator)yrs and lived together for nearly (detail removed by Moderator). He has got angry with others yes and when he’s driving he’s bad but they don’t really hear it. He’s intolerant of people but he has two sides to him, he’s also very polite and respectful and kind to people it depends on his mood but also what other people do. He definitely does it more to me though.

[maddog]

Many years ago I could have written as you have. I protected the abuser. Perhaps I would have protected him forever until there was a trigger. Who knows what that trigger might be. Please keep reaching out.

[Bananaboat]

I used to blame his childhood etc too but then a couple of things dawned on. One – as a child who had a tough time surely you know better than anyone how awful that is and wouldn’t repeat it, two – he only acts this way with me so he can control himself everywhere else.

Sadly they don’t leave, he’ll play every trick in the book to stay including getting nasty. You’re his supply and he ain’t giving you up easily. If you haven’t already read it then read Lundy Bancroft’s book ‘why does he do that’ it really helped me xx

[Hope123]

You are posting on a women aid website. Why are you here?

Childhood abuse does not give permission to abuse others. This is a cycle of behaviour and you will ask this again in a few months. And that ok if you need to.

You do not need permission to walk away. But if you feel that you do need permission to walk away here it is. You get to choose who you are with. You don’t need a reason. It’s ok just to say this is not what I want.

Take care x

[Lovethesea]

He’s not repeating what (detail removed by moderator) did. (detail removed by moderator) was brutal to (detail removed by moderator) children. He was an a alcoholic. My boyfriend has never done anything horrible to my kids he doesn’t tell them off even he’s never got cross with them and they are difficult and not nice themselves sometimes but he leave it to me. He treats them well like he does all children. He doesn’t have any of his own but I know he wouldn’t be like (detail removed by moderator) to them if he did, I know he couldn’t do it because as you say he knows what it’s like and what it does to you. (detail removed by moderator). He actually chose to be violent he planned his violence (detail removed by moderator). My boyfriend isn’t anything like (detail removed by moderator).

[Lovethesea]

I didn’t say it gives him permission. I was saying that he’s experienced trauma and that’s a reason why he is like this, if he wants to change shouldn’t he be given the chance to? Not saying I’m responsible for that he is of course but I can still help him. No one is listening to what I have written. I actually attacked him first in the car so am I an abuser? I’ve done that once before when he said something really hurtful but he didn’t touch me he just told me stop that time and I did. I don’t think I am an abuser but we can all be triggered and have a limit to what we can take. I shouldn’t have done that to him, if he did that first you’d say he was an abuser but he didn’t he was stopping me from hitting him, he shouldn’t have used force but he was defending himself. He hasn’t said that’s what he was doing and that it’s ok, he’s said it was him and it was wrong and he’s sorry. Don’t they usually blame someone else? I’ve said sorry too for what I did. You all think he’s the same as the men you’ve known but you don’t know that for sure. He’s never just attacked me when he’s angry he does verbally abuse me and that is enough for me to end it and I have as I said. I said I have asked him to leave many times and we are not together and we are living separately in our home. I came here to be able to get it out because I have no one to talk to and I do want to know what others think too but I feel you are all angry with me for wanting to help someone who is suffering. We need more love and forgiveness in this world.

[Better-days]

Hi hunni I just want to reach out to u. When I first posted on here I read the replies and thought no my life’s nothing like what being made out and I never posted for about one year later when I realised that it was. I definitely have a very abusive partner who I’m scared to leave. He blames his childhood up bringing too. Which makes me want to leave more than ever with two kids I want to break the cycle. Only you can decide what is best iv tried so hard to heal my partner he’s been to anger management it didn’t work. I used to think he could change I don’t think he can he’s getting worse. I’m sorry your partner has changed in this way but I don’t think he will stop and he might but from my experience it’s got worse since I tried to end it he knows I’m not in love anymore and knows the only way to keep me here is through fear. I really don’t have much advice but keep safe as it could get worse. X*x

[Lovethesea]

He doesn’t blame his childhood he doesn’t blame anything he says it’s him and he hates it. He says he doesn’t know where it comes from but he has this angry he can’t keep in sometimes. He’s not violent that’s what I keep saying he’s never been violent to me it’s only ever been words but I feel that’s worse sometimes. What happened in the car is the first time he’s hurt me physically and he didn’t hit me,he was trying to stop me hitting him by (detail removed by Moderator) but he used too much force and I was fighting him off so I got hurt because he’s so strong.It’s definitely not the same as a man hitting their partner to make them fear them. I’m not saying it’s ok and it is still abuse but it’s not the same. He doesn’t control me or my life. I know you all think he does but he doesn’t. I don’t have low self esteem I’m not suffering I am actually a happy person with a good life and that’s why I ended it when he started the verbal abuse (detail removed by Moderator) months ago I told him I won’t put up with it and I want a happy life and a good relationship. He stopped it for a while and things were good but then (detail removed by Moderator) weeks ago he started it again and so I said he had to find somewhere to live. It took a while was very painful but I was able to emotionally detach myself enough to be able to let him go but he’s been difficult about it. I had to also stop sleeping with him which I’ve only done the last (detail removed by Moderator) but that’s a long time for us. This has made it easier and it’s shown him I mean it. Now this has happened it’s a lot easier. I have moments where I want to keep him but I stop myself doing anything so he doesn’t know. He’s just come home (detail removed by Moderator) and he said he’s found a place to live and he can move out in (detail removed by Moderator) weeks. He’s telling me he loves me and obviously wants sex but i just nicely said I’m sorry but no and he is ok about it. He’s always been very respectful with that. Part of me wants it too but I know I mustn’t because it will make him think I accept what he does and he might not move out. I hope that we do stay friends I think we will I think we’ll get on better that way.

[nbumblebee]

Please know this is meant with kindness and love.
Nobody is angry at you my goodness many of us have felt as you do so please dont think that anyone here is angry with you at all, yes people can change yes we need kindness and understanding but we alao need to open our eyes to those who we cant help not everyone can be saved.
I wasnt gonna replie as you sound so defensive in your replies im not sure you are ready to listen but i wanted you to know when i first came here i was exactly the same i would post on here asking for advice and then when i didnt like what i heard i would answer back with a no hes not like that you dont understand him. Just as you have said and you are right we dont know him or you or your life together just as you dont know ours none of us know what goes on behind closed doors all we can do is share with you our own experiences in the hope that it may help.
Yes often these men will turn it around on is blame us for their abuse but not all the time sweetie theres no shoe that fits all. Mine will often swing it round on me but theres always times where he is so loving so giving so sorry. Its all a game to hold us here to keep us where they want us. As we grow and leaen their abuse gets worse or can change as they somehow see a change in is a spark a knowledge that we see and it scares them they are losing control so they change tactics they up the abuse.
Again no shoe fits all.
You have come on a site for abused women so somewhere deep inside you theres a voice thats telling you this is wrong and no matter how much you try and push it away that voice will keep telling you until you are ready to listen. Only you can decide whether to listen or not.
We get it we do understand we each have different stories but we all understand the fear the pain the confusion you are going through. Ive been here with mine over 2 decades and im still here trying to live alongside him and its miserable ive tried to change him give him a chance ive tried to change myself to fit in with him that didnt work now im trying to claw back a life for myself whilst still living with him and let me tell you its hard too hard some days and im not doing well.
There is no easy answer no right answer we can give you support hugs tell you our stories guide you but at the end of the day its down to you.
As for what you said about you attacking him. Yes it was wrong im sorry but it was however we all lose our s**t dont we? You are not using your strength your dominance to scare him you are not using tactics to intimidate control and install fear in him you just lost your s**t.
We will always listen here so share away but many of us have opinions due to what we have suffered and want to share those so others dont have to go through what we have sone there arw some incredable women on here who have suffered some horrendous things so we all understand i promise you that.
Good luck sweetie. Stay safe xxxx

[Lovethesea]

I’m sorry if I sound defensive but most replies were not reading what I wrote properly and making assumptions that are not true. He doesn’t hit me to try to intimidate me or make me fear him or to control me. His verbal abuse is when I do something wrong or not how he likes or whatever normal things we all do he gets annoyed by them and starts shouting and saying nasty things criticising me and what I’m doing. When we argue it’s really bad what he says. For some couples this is normal arguing his (detail removed by Moderator) for example they do it all the time and are both the same. But it’s not what I do and I hate it, my family never swore at each other we had arguments but they weren’t nasty and insulting each other, his family that’s normal to them. But he knows it’s wrong and it’s abusive especially if I see it that way. He does try to stop doing it and he’s often walked away or driven somewhere to calm down anything to stop himself taking it out on me when he’s having a bad day. But sometimes he doesn’t do that and it comes out and that day in the car was bad the whole journey he didn’t stop going on about (detail removed by Moderator) and it’s hard to drive when someone is doing that so you make mistakes and then he’s worse.

[not-victim]

Hi Lovethesea,

Wow this whole thread has had a really profound effect on me. I completely understand the way you feel and reading your messages I realise I’m the same. I get so defensive when anything negative is said about my husband – even when it’s completely factual. I know I protect him, trying my best to hide his behaviour from others because I don’t want them judging him (or me).

Reading your posts and the responses to your comments makes me realise how long I’ve been doing that (many years) and how, in some way, I’ve allowed the behaviour to continue and grow.
[Disclaimer: I’m not blaming myself for his behaviour, but I am responsible for allowing myself to endure it for so long by not taking action]

My husband is a wonderful man who is loved by everyone who meets him – I’m not joking about that. Everyone who meets him loves him and wants to be around him. Like I say, he’s a wonderful man, just not a great husband. He’s troubled in his own way and I’ve hoped, like you, that by loving and supporting him I can help him “get better” but I realise now it hasn’t worked and I don’t think it ever will. I suppose the question is, how much of your life are you willing to spend waiting for him to get over/come to terms with these deep rooted issues from his childhood that are potentially spurning this behaviour? And are you prepared for the fact that by staying with him and forgiving him you might be communicating to him that the behaviour is acceptable?

It sounds like I know what I’m talking about but actually I haven’t got a clue – it’s easy to sit outside a situation and offer advice but completely different following it! I’ve yet to.

I would say though, the comments on here are all coming from a place of love and care. I imagine many of the women on here recognise the situation you’re in and want to fasttrack you to the place they’re now in (which potentially took them years to get to).

My final thought (again not an expert, just looking from the outside), you seem to be focussed on the physical abuse from your boyfriend. I wonder if the trauma of his (detail removed by moderator) dying has caused the “mask to slip”, so to speak, and resulting in him now being unable to control his “abusive tendencies”. If that’s the case then it’s possible there will have been examples of more emotional or psychological abuse in your relationship before. Maybe read up on some other peoples examples of how that started, with an open mind, and that will help you understand if this behaviour is “new and curable” or just a growing pattern that is likely to get worse.

Whatever happens, please stay on here and share your experiences. Reading your story has helped me get a step closer to leaving my husband so you’ve done something positive there.

[Lovethesea]

The reason I was defensive is because they are not factual. I know what’s happening in my relationship my eyes are open and I have said I don’t want to be with him now because of the verbal abuse I want and deserve and happy peaceful fun life with a man who always treats me respectfully. It’s very sad that it’s not him because I loved him deeply and I do believe he loves me but we often meet someone who brings out all our pain and trauma and triggers from our past, that’s so we can heal them, but we have to do that ourselves and I know that he has to, I can’t do it for him.Maybe losing me will be what he needs to get help and sort himself out Idk I hope so.

[Marmalade]

Lovethesea,
I hear you.
I see both sides.
The ladies on here spring to the defence of new ladies and genuinely want to protect them from the horrors they have themselves suffered. The advice is from a place of concern and care.
But the advice is generic and not individual because often men behave in the same patterns. But there needs to be consideration of individual circumstances and I do not believe it is appropriate to invalidate that.
So honestly, if you had come on here to say that during a row in a car your partner had started hitting you then the ladies would have said he was abusive. You are right. So I can see your frustration.
So this is my honest advice. As your post has been moderated then it is hard to get a sense of the type of abuse. If he becomes physical and controlling when angry, or if you think his behaviour is worsening towards this then I would urge you to contact your local DA agency to help you. You will need help to keep safe. If he is verbally abusive to you when drunk then this is still unacceptable. You have boundaries and these have been broken. You were strong and ended the relationship and now the decision is yours to enforce that (always putting your safety first and if necessary obtaining advice from a DA agency to get him out) or to give him a chance. Most women on this forum have given their partners multiple chances so no one can judge you. If you give him a chance thrn actions speak louder than words. So he would actually need to access counselling and work on his issues if you went down that route. You would need to have boundaries and expectations and be prepared to act if they are broken (so many of us, me included, failed in that).
Ultimately its your decision but your safety is the most important consideration. Best of luck.

[Lovethesea]

He doesn’t become physical when he’s angry he’s never done that to me even when he’s really angry he will say nasty things but he doesn’t hurt me. The verbal abuse is bad enough though I really can’t stand it and he knows how much I hate it. He does try not to do it and he did stop for ages when I said it was over but he started again (detail removed by Moderator) weeks ago and it’s over for me it makes me not feel attracted to him like I did. Before I couldn’t get enough of him lol now I feel different.

[maddog]

Domestic Abuse is a massive thing to unpack. Lovethesea, you’re not alone. We can’t understand what we don’t understand, and then we can’t unsee it. Lots of people stay in abusive relationships until one partner dies. There are masses of complex reasons for this, so whatever direction you take, please don’t be hard on yourself. Nobody ‘just leaves’ an abusive relationship. It’s a bitter pill to swallow.

[Lovethesea]

I am actually completely alone I haven’t told anyone who knows me. I’ve got to do this by myself. I’ve ended it with him, he is moving out he doesn’t want to but he’s said he will because he knows that’s what I want and he knows he’s done too many things that I can’t accept. So we were not sleeping together but the other night I just needed him close and I asked him and he said yes, I said we are not together it doesn’t mean we are back together. Now everything is nice again he’s being really nice to me not once even got annoyed or angry or said anything nasty. I know it won’t last but it just makes it harder, I just have to keep reminding myself why I don’t want to be with him and imagine meeting a man who treats and with the love and respect I deserve forever not just in the beginning. Thanks for your help

[Camel]

Hi Lovethesea

How are you? I’ve come to this quite late so maybe he moved out and you’re moving on. It’s a shame you felt you weren’t being heard, that wrong assumptions were made. It seems to be the norm for new ladies on the forum to ask ‘is this abuse?’ Your first post was different, calling out his abuse in the first line – nasty verbal attacks when you do something ‘wrong’ or ‘not how he likes it.’ Without doubt you are deeply empathic – he never had to blame his childhood experiences because you did that for him. He said sorry but did it again anyway. You say men are never given the chance to change, yet every woman on here has given their abusers countless chances. Every woman on here will tell you how lovely their partner was in the beginning and how they hang on for glimpses of how he was. Not all victims of abuse are frightened into submission. Many describe themselves as strong, argue back, stand their ground, believe it’s not really abuse if they don’t get hit. Every story is different. Yet, every story is the same – A woman asking ‘is it really that bad?’ You don’t have to call it abuse. You don’t have to say he’s an abuser. But you do need to know that good relationships are never, ever this destructive.

[Author]

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