Am I being unfair making out this is “abuse”?

[Galabeee]

Hi everyone
I’ve had a lot of comfort reading posts on the forum so jumping in and joining . .
Like a lot I’ve read I’m genuinely questioning whether the word abuse applies in my marriage , and yet I don’t know why I’d be here if something wasn’t right ..

Short version , together over (detail removed by Moderator) years , there have always been angry outbursts ( verbal, snapping, swearing ) which I’ve always put down to a short fuse and struggling to manage frustration / having a low frustration tolerance .

But it’s escalated massively this past year …. Days of silent treatment , eye rolls, barely saying hi in the morning, ignoring me and any emotions or attempts to make conversation about something …. There have been times over the years he’s grabbed things off me ( not thrown or been physically violent but grabbed in anger ( and left me feeling humiliated and stupid then angry that I’m crying)

I’m at the point where I’m seriously considering leaving as this feels unbearable to live like this , and very unsafe emotionally. ….. I’ve had overnight and emergency stuff I’d need for everyone in the car and some at a friend’s house. .but I’ve never had the guts to do it or have another conversation …as things , anger, and a completely hateful narrative of me just seem to escalate each time and make the living situation feel even worse..

And then I think when he’s ” nice” ….or I get a hello and a smile or asks how my day was, maybe it’s not that bad and I’m making him out to be a monster in my head unfairly ….

I can’t continue living like this though , the dread when he gets home from work never knowing what mood he’ll be in, trying to keep everyone calm so he doesn’t get angry or frustrated … Trying to control everything to impact on his moods or do things “right” in the hope it’ll cheer him up..

I feel like I’ve lost myself …

[Lottieblue]

Hello Galabeee and welcome!

Because your post has been moderated for your protection, there is some detail missing, but I can tell you that my story is exactly the same – except I’m a bit ahead of you! I have been out for a while now (believe me, the route to recovery is not yet over but I now have hope…), having been married for multiple decades and have young adults kids.

You describe your situation brilliantly. I can literally nod at everything as I read it.
I, also, lost myself, and it was then that I knew I had to leave. I didn’t leave then and there – is it ever that simple? But I knew I couldn’t stay. I had stopped functioning as a person, I felt like a shell. So I just worked quietly away at getting my ducks in a row and building up the support I knew I was going to need if I was going to manage to do it. 80% of that support came from this forum, and I also had a lot of contact with my local WA and spoke to a lawyer to make sure that I knew where I stood. Sorted out finances, made sure I had somewhere to go, gathered the documents that mattered etc.
And then I waited. I waited for what I knew would come eventually. The tipping point. The ultimate explosion of rage, when I flicked my V’s. He stormed out, as always, and I left. And I felt that most massive sense of relief and peace. I knew that he would never be able to do that to me again.

Have you read the books that are recommended on here, specifically Lundy Bancroft “Why does he do that?” and Living with the Dominator by Pat Craven? It sounds like you know that his behaviour is abuse, and you know that you want to (and will) leave. What is confusing – for all of us – is how we feel when they are being nice, how we cling on to these moments and ask ourselves has it finished, is it going to be different?

The answer is no.

There is so much more I could say to you, especially re his behaviour since I left, but it’s too detailed for here. Please feel free to make contact with me through PM if you would like to chat more. I’d be really happy to share how it all happened.

Stay strong – we’re all here for you x*x

[Galabeee]

Thank you Lottieblue!
Am so glad to hear you are out …or at least further along!
I feel like I drive myself crazy going backwards and forwards on thinking I’m absolutely leaving …no question….and then wondering if I’m being unfair, overreacting or how I’ll ever manage everything and looking after everyone on my own. I feel like a shell of who I was and just can’t work out how it has come to this….

His version of reality is just so different to mine …I don’t know what the “rules” are in terms of if he’s going to appear “nice/ reasonable/” normal” or full of hate for me and anger. . .( Often at tiny things that don’t make sense to me in the moment).

I feel unsafe in the house without being able to pinpoint why even . .. there’s never been any physical violence but the fear of him hurting something or someone I love is palpable at the moment…. Again , I couldn’t say why ….it’s never been threatened, it just feels something that stops me in my tracks every time I think of finally standing up to him and saying I’m leaving …

I have a solicitors appointment this week to find out implications financially and accomodation wise and then need to line up both things ….as you say for the “next time” ( which of course there will be).

I started why does he do that but not read the other book…my brain is a bit like jelly at the moment too…not sure I’m taking in much!

That’s really kind the offer of PM ing you , I might well take you up on it thank you .

[Lottieblue]

If you were to drop a frog into boiling water it would jump out. If you put a frog into cold water and then just gradually turn the heat up, it won’t notice, and will eventually boil to death.
This is what has happened to you – your water is boiling but you have no idea when the heat was turned up or when it got to that point.
Another book that I have found hugely useful is The Verbally Abusive Relationship by Patricia Evans. It describes so well what you are going through and helps you to understand how you got here. It doesn’t matter if you just find bits that strike home or read a paragraph at a time – it will all help you to build up your strength and the courage of your convictions.

Like you, I tried to have conversations, and like you they were utterly futile. Time and time again, people on this forum told me to leave without telling him and then to go no contact. I kept insisting that there had to be another way – why would I not act like the reasonable person that I am? But eventually I realised they were right. So that’s what I did. It was complete self-preservation… I was so broken. It’s a really difficult point to get to, realising that that’s the only way. But the bottom line is, you cannot win. He is never going to say “yes, I see, you’re right, you need to leave”.
It’s Hell. It is incredibly difficult to do and it takes a monumental amount of strength, but you can do it, like I did. What are the options? Living like this for the rest of your life? The rest of your life.
Because he’s not going to change.

[Galabeee]

Hi Lottieblue
Yes the frog in boiling water is how I feel right now …like I don’t even have the strength to jump out…
And he’s being nice …. Or at least not horrible, while I feel like I’m falling apart , like I’m a total mess. .

It’s hard not to think I could have a reasonable and rational conversation about what we do next ..or that there’s not something I could do to get him to change things “back”…

[Galabeee]

This week has been really really tough ….he has been quite civil which is making me doubt my sanity/ reality …
I’m questioning if it is my fault the or because of things I’ve done he’s treated me how he has ( silent treatment, stonewalling, swearing when angry)..

I’m questioning if it’s really “bad enough” to leave a marriage and break up our home and family . .

And at the same time feeling trapped having thought I’d sorted a living situation for us outside of him that has now fallen through …

I feel like I constantly go backwards a d forwards between 2 different “realities”

[Galabeee]

There’s more than that but it’s the emotional/ psychological stuff that has been the constant…..

[Lottieblue]

This is perfectly normal abuser behaviour. Google Cycle of Abuse.
About a year before I actually left, I had an incident where I finally knew that things were never going to change, and that I would, eventually, leave him. In the intervening year, things went up and down, not drastically so, but I started to get stuff sorted. I knew that I needed to be ready for when the moment came, when I would have that fire in my belly. I knew I would never leave while he was being nice, so I had to be ready to do it when he wasn’t.

The feelings you are going through are so, so normal. Is it me? Can I ride the rough times in order to enjoy the good times in between?

The questions I urge you to ask are: can I live like this for another 30/40/50 years? Will it get better or worse once the kids have grown up and left? If I stay for another 10 years, will I still have the strength to leave – and if I do, I’ll have wasted those 10 years just waiting.

I don’t intend to persuade you to do something that’s not right for you. But what’s stopping you from leaving at the moment is the trauma bond. Read, read, read. He doesn’t get to pick and choose whether he’s nice to you or not. I am still trying to get my head round my husband’s behaviour. But I can tell you one thing unequivocally… no matter how much soul-searching I have done since leaving, I have not once regretted it.

[Galabeee]

Thank you @Lottieblue
I’ll Google the cycle…I feel like what started as thoughts 6 months ago of “maybe I need to broach the idea of going to couples counselling” …. At the same time of moments of ” I can’t do this anymore” ( “this” being the relationship)….

Whereas now …. I’m questioning…is that ..do I need that ? Or do we just need to , as I’ve been doing …get my stuff together , slowly try and sort things ..because I’m not sure the civil/ nice will last …I just don’t know …

I totally hear you on it being hard to leave when they are nice …and the bit about picking and choosing whether he is nice to me or not , THAT is the biggest thing ….that I wrap myself in circles trying to figure out what I’ve “done” for the nice to stop ( or what I can do to make it start again)…it’s constant …and exhausting .

It’s helpful to hear that you are out the other side …but also that the impact is still there , lots to think about …

[nbumblebee]

The good days are why I stay they make me doubt all I learn on here. I almost hate the good days as much as the bad. But someone said to me once if they were bad all the time we most likely would leave much sooner.
You will drive yourself mad questioning the why there is never a reason its just because they can.
I often sit and watch out the window for his van to pull up with that fear that dread that knot in your tummy wondering what mood he is in. Ive recently started working which he hates with a passion if he is home b4 me ny kids text me and warn me he is in a mood as im not home!!!
I dread going home I hate going home.
I have tried to be the woman he wants me to be but its never enough and ive lost me in trying to do so Ive been married over 2 decades never saw anything wrong until covid hit and even now I fight it I refuse to believe.
Lottieblue is spot on read read read and learn. Arm yourself with as much information as you can, is there anyone you can talk too? Reach out to? Its takes bravery but it will be worth it to have someone there for you is priceless. Use this forum the ladies on here are incredable and have amazing stories of strength and courage they have held me up and continue to every day.
Just know it isnt you or anything you do sweetie the problem lies within him you just have to try and look after you undersatnd whats going on and how best to deal with it. Baby steps will carry you foward.
Stay safe xx

[Galabeee]

Thank you to all of you for replying. @nbumblebee
Yes you are right , if the “bad” was constant or would stop the constant questioning and backwards and forwards … And I definitely would have left by now …. It’s the times of ” nice” or just ” not mean” that keep me staying and questioning …

I know what you mean though about the feeling of watching for when I get get home, and the dread…..and the trying to second guess the moods. I’m so sorry you have it hitting so hard …

I have started reaching out more to some friends …it helps give another outside reality check/ perspective …. But I still worry as they aren’t hearing his “side” maybe they are just siding with me without having the full picture …. Like maybe there’s something in me ( as he often says it’s something I’ve done) that causes the moods and the actions/ treatment that follows …

I will definitely read some of the books suggested though , I’ve ordered one of them already …

Stay safe too
Thank you

X

[nbumblebee]

Why do you want them to hear his side sweetie?
This isnt needed what hurts you hurts you end of.

I have been abused and raped by different family members during my life so this it must be me idea really sticks with me so I get it I really do its a question i ask myself day after day what do i do to make people hate me so? Maybe if I change he will?
Many women on here will say NO they wont change ever you can change yourself a thousand times blame yourself over and over but in reality he wont ever be happy as the problem is within him not you.
Dont blame yourself.
I hope the books help.
Stay safe xx

[Galabeee]

Thank you @nbumblebee
I think it’s more I think there are 2 viewpoints and his is obviously very different to mine so I feel like I’m painting him in a bad light when I talk about what’s happening to friends ( as I’m obviously leaving out the good/ other side of him). I’m slowly working my way through the book , it is interesting to see some of the behaviours in there ….

I’m sorry you have been through abuse and rape too , it leaves a terrible question of ” is there something about me? That causes me to be treated this way” ( even when logically the answer is of course “no”

Thank you for listening , I’m trying to take everyone’s words and thoughts in.

[Fairyliquid]

Hi Galabee,

Thats always where my head is.
Have I told their side,
Do I only reach out when upset so friends and family and therapist only hear one side.

So when they say its abuse I find it so difficult to believe.

Especially when I am made to believe “embellish my truth so that no one else knows the real truth”.

Its helpful to know there are other people in the same situation.
Not as lonely

[Eggshells]

Hi Galabee

Others can tell you if they feel its abuse or not but I’d recommend that you answer the question for yourself. Even if others agree that it’s abuse now, you’ll question it over and over during the journey you are about to embark on. Coming to your own conclusion can ease this path (but won’t completely prevent you questioning yourself).

Of all the books recommended on this site, I found “Living with the Dominator” gave me the clearest idea about whether or not I was experiencing abuse.

There is still alot of confusion around what constitutes abuse because the popular media so often portrays abuse as violent or obvious. To show the insidious and multiple natures of abuse is difficult if you want people to notice what you are trying to show.

“Living with the Dominator” discusses the different types of abuse and it gives examples of each type on a spectrum of the most subtle to the most overt. At the beginning of my journey when I first asked “Is it abuse?” the book not only showed me that it clearly was abuse but also made me aware of the sheer extent of the abuse I’d been experiencing.

As you go through your journey of discovery, please consider keeping a journal of his behaviour. Also, maybe think about getting a voice activated digital voice recorder that you can pop in your pocket. Listening back to arguments and conversations can be very enlightening and exposes how they twist and turn arguments to manipulate and confuse.

[Galabeee]

@eggshells
Thank you too. I’ve ordered the book and I’m glad it helped you too to realise what you’d been living through. I hear you , on needing to come to my own conclusion on what is happening ( even though I know some of it without question would fall under the definition of abuse , I second guess myself …either that that was the intention/ whether he knows what he is doing or the impact or / whether I’ve “caused it” therefore it’s somehow justified ( which then makes it “less abusive”). Of course none of these are things I’d think about anyone else in this situation ….but this whole thing just feels like it scrambles my brain …

[Everhopeful321]

I just wanted to say thank you – I struggle to put into words how my situation feels but I feel like it’s being described word for word here x

[Galabeee]

@everhopeful321
I’m so sorry you are experiencing this too….finding the words is so so hard at times to even be able to explain it …

I’ve found just reading here so many posts resonate and used the chat too which was really helpful.

[Darknessallaround]

@Galabeee, reading your post resonated with me so much. It’s the little drip-feed of ‘ok’ times which keeps us hooked and makes us doubt that things really are that bad.

I’ve left more than once and have gone back more than once. Apparently it’s an average of 7 times before a woman leaves an abusive relationship for good.

I read other women’s stories on here and think how resilient they are and how brave to leave and stay away. I can’t imagine going through it all again and don’t believe I will have the strength and courage to do so.

There’s a lot of cognitive dissonance in existing between two realities and the longer it goes on, the harder it gets.

If I could offer any advice, it would be to leave as soon as is practical, and have some support around you when doing so, if at all possible.

[Galabeee]

Drip feeding sounds right …like there’s sometimes just “enough” not bad …and ..to make me second guess myself ..

I’m hope , for you, that you can find support around you to channel the strength you have too …I can understand leaving, and I can understand going back, and the questioning yourself …

It feels very much where I’m at right now .

[pookie1]

Hi, I’m sorry to hear what you’ve been going through. The problem we all face is that we’re conditioned to no longer trust our instincts. Gaslighting over many years is abusive and dealing with someone’s else’s anger and preempting your behaviour in response is a trauma response. This is a cycle of abuse and you’re suffering. Everyone here understands 100%. I’ve been separated for nearly (detail removed by Moderator) now after (detail removed by Moderator) years and I’m dealing with a lot of trauma and whilst it’s painful the realisation of what I’ve tolerated keeps me moving forward. Once you see the behaviour for what it is “the lightbulb moment” you cannot unseen it. I hope you’re able to confide in someone and access therapy – these two things changed everything for me. I’d never spoken about my relationship and voiced my concerns because I’d been made to feel like I was the problem and I carried a lot of guilt and shame. I don’t anymore I now know I’ve been emotionally abused for many years.I hope you’re able to find someone to talk to face to face and get the support you need x*x

[Galabeee]

Thank you @pookie1
The gaslighting and questioning my own reality and judgement on things is a big thing for me ..
I pre empt moods and anger all the time and definitely censor what I say and how I say it so as not to p**s him off ….and I’m just exhausted by it all….

And there are things that have been said ( and the way they’ve been said and justified) that feel very hard to get past or forgive ….like I can’t ” unsee”

I’m glad the guilt for you feels like it’s shifted …

I’ve started talking to friends some more …all of whom had no idea any of this was going on …I’m hoping it’ll start to help ..

[teaandbiscuit24]

I could have written every word of this. I left but still flip flop between thinking yes it was abusive to me over reacting, not that bad really etc etc. He would also deny all if I ever confronted him. I don’t think he is aware of the impact though my counsellor disagrees……

[Galabeee]

@lostinagoodbook
Yes …same , I don’t think he would agree he’s treated me abusively at all or that it’s had the impact it has … I feel like I go backwards and forwards on whether it’s abusive or not ( it feels like it in the moment) but now he’s in a “nice” phase and I question myself…that could it really have felt so bad 2 weeks ago that I’d packed everything important and was terrified of going to sleep near him …

It makes me feel I can’t trust myself or my judgement ..or what’s actually happening .

[Llgirl]

I’m fresh out of leaving and have these back and forth feelings all the time, when I’m having a meeting with my support worker and they have a plan in place for certain things I think, surely not, but deep down we know something isn’t right, I would never have fled my home and left my whole life behind for something that “wasn’t that bad” it’s just so hard not to think of the person I fell in love with and a bitter pill to swallow that they didn’t exist, it was always part of a bigger plan, I thought because I wasn’t cowering in a corner crying and was able to come and go as I please that it wasn’t abuse, that’s what they want us to think

[Galabeee]

@Llgrl
I understand the back and forth and questioning yourself . I’m very much there too …like you say we know when something isn’t right and you wouldn’t have left your while life like that. It’s just hard to make the next step ….or not second guess myself out of it. .

[Llgirl]

I’m not long out of it but already feel like I’m not living in fear anymore, I get a right chest remembering being back home, support is out there, we’re in this together x

[Galabeee]

I’m so glad @Llgirl …
The fear-free feeling is so deserved! That’s my end goal , getting home and it feeling like a place of safety at the end of the day ..
Hope you are doing okay

[teaandbiscuit24]

I didn’t realise until talking to a counsellor how much I had adapted my lifestyle/ behaviour and that of the kids to avoid his moods. She pointed out the reason I always backed down (like a doormat I thought) was because in early arguments he’d progressed to intimidation/ hitting furniture/ pacing/ throwing soft objects etc. I always felt I shouldn’t push too far and do believe he could be provoked. I am waiting in some nervousness for when he accepts I’m really not changing my mind- he either loves/ hates people generally.

[Galabeee]

@lostinagoodbook
I understand the adapting around moods too , it’s good your counselling is helping you make sense of it a bit more.

I suspect if I really let myself think about it there would be lots more examples for me too. It’s been mainly verbal and gestures ( snapping, eye rolls, sarcasm, silent treatment etc) with the occasional incident of things being grabbed ( but not thrown) when angry …a lot of contempt, justification of all this behaviour ….tracking my location ( under the house of concern/ security ….but I’m not sure anymore …)

Even as I write it I feel like it’s not bad “enough” to justify thinking about leaving …..other than I know deep down this isn’t what “love” or ” marriage” is supposed to feel like ….

[Camel]

Perhaps the question should be, is it good enough to stay?

[Galabeee]

That’s a very good way of looking at it @Camel …and my instant reaction to that question was ” no, it isn’t”

I just feel trapped ….

[teaandbiscuit24]

Camel says what my counsellor says! But I understand your approach Galabeee as that’s how I think too. I find that my gut/ body can be telling me to stay/ get away whilst my rational brain is telling me there’s nothing to worry about etc. I understand you are meant to trust your gut as there is a reason for the reaction. Also, my original plan was to leave when the kids left- which would have been wrong. They need a healthy relationship modelling to them.

Stuff won’t ever be bad enough with the boiling frog approach…. I argued strongly that it was only a cushion when explaining him hitting me with it for saying something stupid. The point was he was angry not how harmful the object was she said. And the lack of respect.

[Galabeee]

Thank you @Lostinagoodbook

I can understand the feeling of thinking you’ll stay for the kids till they are older, but it takes a huge amount of courage to leave. I’m trying to find and harness that right now ….

It’s the contempt and lack of respect for me ….and wish to control with no empathy or , it seems ability ( or wish?) to see that there may be anything valid in how I feel …

I need to harness the courage as well as maybe do some practical thinking too about next steps…

[Galabeee]

Tried to go in for another conversation , I suggested relationship counselling ( it was a “no” from him) …don’t know why I’m trying to salvage anything or give a chance …I just feel like I can’t / shouldn’t just walk out on this many years of marriage…and leave myself in potentially and even more vulnerable position ….

But the attitude, justification of abusive and controlling behaviours …including gaslighting, silent treatment etc was mind-blowing …and yet a couple of days later I’m questioning myself and my reality … ” Maybe he’s right” ” maybe I’ve treated him like c**p” ( one of the accusations)

He’s making so many counter allegations …that I drink so much, that I’m not emotionally “stable” ( hence crying at times after being sworn at/ ignored/ silent treatment or just the atmosphere . You know the one where you just can FEEL the fury and contempt …)

I’m struggling to keep a sense check on my own reality in all this and I know I need to get out , I just feel so trapped …

[teaandbiscuit24]

I completely get this. I still feel trapped as I have to see him every week with the kids. I get to a point where I start to see his behaviour abusive, stop feeling guilty and acknowledge my own feelings of betrayal and dirtiness etc. Then I see/ hear from him and all of a sudden he’s the victim again and I feel like I’m going crazy.

Significant dates/ places do the same- flash up the good times(most was good) and it’s like my brain buries the c**p bits. I got angry briefly for the first time and was so relieved but straight back to distress and feeling I made a huge mistake.

He keeps saying we both need support for mental health and then can get back together. I thought my mh was screwed because of him but there are childhood issues so perhaps he is right. I know it’s messed up but I have wished so many times he would just hit me so I can stop second guessing myself.

[teaandbiscuit24]

A suggestion from a friend after she witnessed inconsistent statements; write down events and comments in order to refer back to. I’m going to start doing this- wish I had weeks ago. Think it may help with the crazy feeling. X

[Galabeee]

That’s really tough it’s crazy-making isn’t it??? @lostinagoodbook
I like your friends idea of writing things down ….I’ve done that a little bit when the “nice” ( aka ” not awful” stage starts I question even that! …..

[Stuckinturmoil]

@galabeee I am in such a similar situation. We have been together for multiple decades too. My only relationship so I have nothing to compare it to. I have seen 3 different counsellors as deep down I want them to tell me it’s all in my head. But unfortunately they don’t. I have been told I am the front in boiling water too.
When he is in a good mood or chatting to work colleagues on Teams I think he is so nice but it doesn’t take much for the angry monster to come out.
This week I have told him I have started the divorce. What has struck me as odd is he is playing the victim sulking but has not once asked me why I am divorcing him. He hasn’t once said we can try to work it out and he hasn’t once said he loves me.
I keep thinking if I stay with him one day I will be in an old people’s home remembering this time of my life when I should have done something. It’s killing me and I am scared.

[Galabeee]

I’m so sorry @stuckinturmoil
It’s such a tough place to be in isng it? Constantly questioning yourself as to what is happening. I know so well the difference in hearing him talk nicely to others and then it’s like it switches off and total contempt replaces it when he sees me ….
Or angry silence …

Starting divorce proceedings is a huge step , I hope one day to be in a space where I can gather all the courage to actually leave . It’s like I almost get there ….and then he’s a little bit nicer and I start feeling guilty , and sorry for him, and like maybe he’s right in some of the things he’s telling me ….

[Galabeee]

I can’t believe it’s 2 months later and I still haven’t done anything …, I was so close to leaving and then started second guessing myself , maybe we could “fix” things ….

Several more conversations where I try and get my point across and end up feeling “crazy” or like everything is being blamed on me …. Everything he is doing and how he treats me , I’m told is ” only exactly as I treat him”

I started relationship counselling ( individually) as he refuses to go …. But I’m left feeling even more confused like maybe the way he’s responded and treated me is okay and Counsellor saying things like he needs to feel ” heard” ( I never felt like I haven’t showed him I hear him or care)

I just feel trapped and like I’ve become a shell of who I was the past almost year of this really escalating ….

[nbumblebee]

Hey. Know what ive been here 2 years and nothing has changed so dont feel bad about the time scale i guess we all move at our own pace in my case i think im setting a new slowmo world record!!!
The doubt is what keeps us here that creeping n****e that we dont deserve better that little voice that says “hey hes not so bad see” when they are in the nice cycle. All this is just so hard to get. I said to someone on here today I just wish the world would stop and let me breathe.
So take whatever time you need do whatever you need to do but dont doubt yourself never doubt. If your counsellor isnt working out change find a new one it sometimes takes a while till you find one but the fact that you are going and he is not surely must tell you something?
Re read your posts on here if you need to remember what hes really like how he makes you feel, its not you its him sweetie.
Dont doubt what you know deep down inside.
Much love n hugs xxxx

[Galabeee]

Thank you @ nbumblebee
I know deep down it’s not about timescales …there’s no time limit on it all…

Except the longer it goes on the bigger the impact it has on me and I worry I’m losing myself in the process .

I understand that feeling of just wanting to breathe ….I’d hoped counselling would have helped give that feeling but I almost feel more trapped as it feels like it’s echoing the voice from him of ” have I considered his side?”…

Maybe I need to look into other options …and yes I think it’s interesting I’m going and he isn’t , but I think it feeds into his narrative that it’s me and not him with the “problem”

Thank you so much for your reply

[tiredofitall]

I’ve read your posts here and I can relate so much. I went to counselling 3 times to try and improve our relationship. You can guess who didn’t go to counselling. Speak volumes doesn’t it? I spent decades in a marriage where I was scared to be myself, scared to do anything and scared not to do things – getting criticised all the time. He would not by physically violent but he would throw things, break things and be visibly raging a lot. So you would live in a fear of what could set that off. He’s held me against walls and screamed in my face. And I thought because he wasn’t punching me then it wasn’t that bad. He always justified it as me making him behave like that because of something I said or did. And I ended up becoming someone I didn’t like much either.
It took me a veryvlong time to leave but I started to see his treatment of me for whst it was and I guess I subconsciously just started thinking about life without him. I got to a place where I knew I could support myself and the children financially. I just didn’t know if I’d ever be brave enough to do it. Then one day after 4 hours of being ranted at, I just snapped. I didn’t want to live like that ant more.
It’s not been easy. But I’ve been in my own home now for a few months and the change is amazing. We are free to do what we want.
Don’t judge yourself – just keep going x

[Galabeee]

I’m sorry @tiredofitall that you went through all that.
I think because there’s been no physical violence ( other than grabbing things off me when angry but rarely ( maybe once a year ) ….I minimise the impact of the silent treatment, mocking, eye rolls etc …

And then he can be nice and feels more like the person I always thought he was and I question myself and my interpretation of it all ….

Going to counselling on my own feels like I’m just questioning even more whether is “my” problem somehow ..

[Galabeee]

I’m so glad you’ve managed to get out too x

[Stormie]

Tiredifitall
I loved this post, you did it, you left
I don’t know you and I feel proud of you.

I started the planning phase least year, bought my own car … Saved my money and I’m so close. I want to get him out of the home.

Can I ask you a question, did or does anyone the full story about the abuse?

I have a three friends who know bits, never tell them everything because I stay and look stupid and this week I told my parents how bad it is.

I am so worried that I will be judged and people will think, no way, he’s so nice, best bloke round here, he wouldn’t do that. .

He’s nice to everyone, except me x*x

[tiredofitall]

I’m so sorry I didn’t see this sooner. I started sharing one or two examples of his behaviour with people to justify why I didn’t want to be with him anymore. Every time, they were shocked and it made me realise just how much I had rationalised as normal when it really wasn’t. I could tell some people weren’t sure whether he was just going through a rough patch so I shared more then they got it. I never once waive in my conviction that he did not treat me well. Whether you call that abuse or not doesn’t matter.
Some people know people like that so they get it straight away. But the more I shared the better I felt and the more supported I felt. I hope you have the same. x

[Darknessallaround]

@Galabeee, Counselling can work, but not couples counselling… They are trained to see a situation from both sides and you will always end up feeling invalidated and second guessing yourself. Please see an individual therapist, preferably one who is experienced in abuse / trauma work.

[Galabeee]

Thank you @Darknessallaround
This counsellor offers individual counselling ( also around trauma) but it’s the “trying to see it from both sides” that feels like it has me questioning myself and my reality …
Ironically we’ve spoken about other experiences of abuse. ..and the impact on me….and yet when it comes to current situation and within my marriage I’m somehow expected to ” understand and try and communicate”. . I just don’t know.

[Twisted Sister]

Hi Galabee

When you are in an abusive situation and a counsellor does this ‘see it from both sides’, its further emotional and psychological harm to you, which is why you end up feeling the way you do. I’m so sorry that you have suffered as you have only to trust someone who purports to help you, and then denies your abuse.

Its definitely not your responsibility to ‘understand’ anything from the perspective of an abuser, as what is happening is that its actually him that isn’t understanding the perspective of an abuser. Frankly, I would buy him ‘Living with the Dominator’ and walk away, he is undoing your recovery by talking about things in a way that is in denial of abuse. You have spent plenty of your own time denying abuse, the last thing you need is to place trust in someone to help who then denies it too!

You take care, and know that when you feel this way, something is wrong.

warmest wishes

ts

[Galabeee]

Thank you TS …it does feel like the counsellor at times seeing from both sides is making me feel worse ( albeit I’m the only one going so it’s guesswork on both our parts!) …

Other times I feel more relief at ” maybe it okay , maybe this is just “normal” relationship/ communication issues and I don’t need to leave ….

I don’t even trust myself or my judgement anymore …that’s one of the hard parts …

[Twisted Sister]

You should not be concerning yourself with the ‘other side’, there is no ‘other side’ in abuse, its just abuse, and cannot and should not be excused in any way, or should there be attempts to understand his abuse. He should be on a perpetrator programme and you need to be kept safe and helped to understand how difficult abuse is to deal with and have help to recover from trauma and stay safe.

Understanding someone who abuses, in relation to your behaviours in a couple, is abuse.

I hope you can understand this and keep away from those kinds of ‘understandings’.

warmest wishes

ts

[Galabeee]

Thank you TS.
I know I need to move away from tying myself in knots trying to see his point of view …it does feel like I’m almost having to justify to the counsellor why I felt so awful and frightened of him ( there’s been no physical violence ever …other than a few incidents of grabbing things off me when angry ) but it’s far more the emotional stuff ( eye rolls, silent treatment, anger , mocking / sarcasm)….. A lot of that seems to have died down now so it’s like I question if it even really happened or if it was really ” that bad”

I just can’t see a future where I can ever trust or feel safe with someone whose treated me like he has …

[Twisted Sister]

I can see why you would feel like that, and I can’t recommend enough that you find a therapist that won’t have you doubting yourself over his abuses. Its honestly, in my opinion, better to not have a therapist than one who makes you feel like this, because this is further gaslighting for you to deal with. You are very traumatised, and that comes from feeling under continual threat from him, a loaded gun doesn’t have to be fired, or even have a bullet in it, for you to feel your life could be over. Its the same threat response whether its physical or threat of it, and when you can see how angry and capable an overpowering man could be, thats what matters.

Maybe your therapist doesn’t realise this. Therapist are all different and finding the best one for you is essential.

warmest wishes

ts

[Lightning-Jet]

Ah sweetheart, I too have asked myself if I am being unfair about the abuse I receive at home.
The frog analogy is a very good one. In the beginning, its all nice, overly nice in many cases. But you feel so swept off your feet and happy; you don’t see the potential for anything to be wrong. The love bombing stage – where its all hearts and flowers, gifts – full of promises. They seem like the perfect catch. They do everything they can to build your trust.
Gradually, the gas is turned on and the ignition button is pressed. The increase in heat is so slow, you don’t notice it. The odd nasty comment here and there, little excuses to stop you seeing your family/friends, then the gaslighting may start – no you’re not remembering things correctly, I didn’t say that, you did. They may start to criticise the things you do; telling you that you are a rubbish home maker, that you don’t look after them like you should. They may accuse you of cheating, monitor your social media or when you are showing as online. They may start to embarrass you, or make fun of you in front of friends, they may use the children to get at you. It will slowly intensify day by day and eventually, they control your life without you realising. By this time, the water is at boiling point and you are still there.
In my experience, I have found that after a day or 2 of the eye rolling, silent treatment, making you feel on edge and awkward – its like the flick of a switch and its all changed. You see a glimmer of the person you fell for. All feels better for a short time, you may have even had an apology. But you don’t stay on that part of the cycle for long and they soon start to head towards the next stage of the cycle where the slowly start to ramp up the abusive behaviour again.
People often ask why you don’t just leave. Its not that simple. You get addicted to the highs and lows – you are feeling stressed a lot of time and crave feeling pleasure. That little glimmer hope is what you naturally cling to.
Its important to realise that their arguments, are circular. There is no beginning or end to them – you just go round and round and round. They have an answer for everything, even if that answer is wrong – they will be adamant that they are right. The only way to get out of the cycle of abuse, is to break that cycle. Which is easy said, but so hard to actually do.
There is so much more to life, you deserve so much better! I need to break the cycle myself, I know I have to, but I feel like I am tied up in knots.

[Galabeee]

I hope you manage to untangle it all,, it’s so hard I know and the boiling frog analogy is about right…. Like I have no energy left to.move one way or another ….

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