Learning lessons from this recent experience

[SunshineRainflower]

Hi everyone,

Thanks for helping me with my situation with the man who asked me on a date. The experience with him has raised some new questions for me and has been upsetting but also quite helpful too.

It’s bothered me that as soon as I received his message, part of my brain seemed to instantly get highjacked. I go into this ‘aw isn’t that cute, how sweet, how flattering, it must have taken guts for him to do that bless him, I should probably give him a chance’ mode. Ie. I assume good intention and good character on the part of the unknown man and put his needs before my own, the needs of an absolute stranger! I think this is because as women we are socialised to put men first and put ourselves second. Plus my mother has always taken my brother’s side when he’s done some really horrible things to his exes so I think it warped my sense of seeing men as they are and making them accountable.

I then started to project onto this man, imagining him to be a good person, assuming he liked me because of our shared interest, when I knew absolutely nothing about him. Worse still, although I could see them in plain sight, the highjacked part of my brain wanted to brush off his dismissal of the recommendation I gave him and ignore his obvious careless/poor spelling and grammar and the way he was trying to fast track me in meeting him for a drink rather than continuing our chat about our hobby. A good man would have used the hobby to continue the conversation and then maybe suggested a date building on that. When I read back his messages now it was like he was saying ‘anyway, enough about the hobby, let’s cut to the chase, how about we have sex?’ But at the time I couldn’t even analyse his message properly because I felt too muddled. I could feel the other part of my brain going ‘oh dear this guy is totally unsuitable’ but at the time I couldn’t work out which part of my brain to listen to. I didn’t know which was the healed part and which was the unhealthy still needs healing part.

I’m very glad I shared on here, and I also checked the boundaries and dealbreakers lists I wrote for myself last year, as well as lists of red flags. Thankfully all of that helped me untangle it and I was able to see the situation clearly again. It just scares me how I might have got sucked down the rabbit hole again into a completely unsuitable relationship with an immature man who was already making sexual innuendos before even going on a date. It scares me how I would even consider going on a date with someone like that, but I always seem to have to battle with a few parts of my brain that are a) scared to be alone b) overly romantic and believing the best in people c) flattered d) scared of missing out on an opportunity and also d) the trauma re-enactment part of my brain that subconsciously looks for a toxic person because they are familiar to me.

I saw a therapist briefly after leaving my ex and she seemed to understand abuse and trauma. She told me that my relationships were ‘Trauma Re-enactment’ which is where you look for a similar person to a caregiver in childhood who was unable to give or receive love and who was usually abusive in one or more ways. This is because the subconscious brain wants to ‘finally get the love it never got’ and it erroneously thinks it can get it from this new similar person. It was so helpful learning about trauma reenactment because it explains why I’ve been in several abusive relationships.

One thing I’ve noticed happens when I meet these toxic types is I often get this instant attraction to them, it’s like this intense eye to eye contact and a ‘wow’ moment. I got it with this man I met. It made me feel uncomfortable. I think they feel it too hence why they then ask me out. I always used to think that it meant there was ‘chemistry’ and that it was a good thing but having been in two relationships with men I got that intense ‘wow’ eye to eye feeling for who ended up being very abusive, cruel, gaslighting and downright horrible I’ve realised that it can’t be a healthy genuine ‘attraction’ and in fact I think it’s to do with trauma re-enactment. I am going to call it Trauma Re-enactment Reaction (TRR) because I think in future it will help me to identify men to avoid. I think it was Pia Mellody, an author on love addiction and codependency who said, when she gets that intense ‘wow’ feeling for men she runs in the other direction and instead dates men where the attraction builds slowly and is based on genuine things not some intense energy.

I can see now why I’ve dated some really unsavoury characters who I am embarrassed to have dated. I had nothing in common with them, they were totally unsuitable for me in terms of lifestyle, values, hobbies and goals but got this really intense attraction to them and every time I think it was TRR.

I watched a bit of the programme ‘Love is Blind’ last night and it made me cry because several of the men are so polite, gentle, kind, interesting, intelligent, education, respectful, respectable and responsible and they treated their partners so well, it highlighted how I’ve never had that with anyone. It made me feel so rubbish and sad thinking ‘why do those women get men like that and I don’t.’ On the other hand, it was also helpful to show me men like that do exist and that men treating women like that is what I should expect and hold out for, not make do with some horrible man who can’t even be bothered to show basic respect. I have actually been on several dates with men like this years ago online dating but because there was no TRR I took that to meant there was no attraction. I feel a bit disappointed now because if I dated them now I would appreciate them more and would understand the difference between TRR and genuine attraction. What feels worse is when I tried online dating after a break, I no longer attracted men like this and instead was only attracting all the ones who were bad news.

I watched a few videos online about ‘why you attract the men you do’ and a lot of them are quite harsh and basically say we attract men similar to us/we attract horrible men if we don’t value ourselves. I feel like I absolutely do value myself and love myself after all of the learning I’ve done and understanding about these topics, but I’ll probably always struggle with my mental health on and off and I can’t be some cookie cutter Stepford wife. That doesn’t mean I don’t expect to make an effort and find someone great, there’s still a lot of work I can do on myself to improve myself and my life, and I’m enjoying slowly being on that journey. It just worries me a bit thinking, are these sorts of men the only types I’ll attract. I suppose it’s about getting out of victim mentality and moving into a place of independence and strength. I just don’t want to be blamed if I attract horrible men, as if it’s my fault. It does feel a bit depressing that I’d attract a man like this recent man after all of the work and learning I’ve done.

On the other hand, someone else said, all women attract unsavoury characters, our only job is to say no to them. I found that more helpful, because I don’t like the idea of my worth being reflected in these men who can’t even be bothered to spell properly and who just want sex when I’m educated, clean, I look after my body and my health, I dress to suit my body, I exercise, I read, I’m a good kind person and I have a lot of skills and life experience. I feel like I have a lot to offer a relationship and don’t want my past as an abuse survivor and the fact that I struggle at times with my mental health to mean that I just have to settle for one of these disrespectful men or be alone.

Anyway thanks for listening and it would be good to hear any thoughts on this.
Sunshine

[Shaz]

Hi there

I have to thank you as you have eloquently put into a few paragraphs many of my problems. The attraction of unhealthy men, the feeling of wanting a good man but never seeming to find one whereas other women do, and the links to childhood caregivers and the need to get ‘that’ love. The latter is probably, if not certainly the reasons for my trouble in attracting the right type. Or I believe so anyway.

My father was absent from a very young age and I never really knew him at all. Psychologically this absence (or rather having been there, and then left) is a well known driver of attachment (or non-attachment) styles in relationships (my memory of this may be a little off but this is what I vaguely recall). As a result I think I have subconsciously ‘searched’ for this love all my life, always seeking an identity to fit into also (my father was not from the UK). I have therefore gone through many phases wanting to be something or someone, and dated men who could never be good for me because I wasn’t dating them because they treated me well, but because I wanted their love, their acceptance so I could finally fit in somewhere. It really hasn’t worked.. I still seem unable to attract good men and I still feel like I don’t know where I belong.

Another thing that I wanted to mention is that often, the more we think about something, the more it becomes this big ‘problem’. I am not saying you should not be considering these things; yet I have found that sometimes issues such as this don’t always necessary have an easy answer. Sometimes it’s ok to let go of all the questioning and just find who you are and be content. Our society tells us its not ok to be on our own- but I and many other ladies on here always speak about how liberating and freeing it is be single!

I have also watched some videos on self-esteem and the link to choosing bad men. I think that links to the care-giver issue and the need to be loved being so important you will accept almost anything below standard. I get that. Its something I am trying to work on. One thing I have done to be more content with who I am is to come off all social media. Its really therapeutic and I never, ever have to read about how wonderful this person’s life is. This will always lead to comparing yourself with others and that is very detrimental to one’s mental health. Find who you are (you seem to have a very good grasp which is great), revel in who you are and be proud of it. If you love cats get another one, go and help at a sanctuary or rescue centre, or just be happy that these things bring you happiness and calm (I know mine do!)

Just some thoughts on your post for now, if I have any more I will post again.

Shaz x

[iliketea]

Such an amazing insightful and eloquent post. All of it rang true. Thank you.x

[SunshineRainflower]

Thank you Shaz and Iliketea.

Shaz, it sounds like your absent father has meant you’ve looked for men who are emotionally absent if that makes sense. My father was present but he wasn’t really emotionally present. We haven’t had healthy love modelled for us so it’s no wonder we didn’t know what it looked like and thought it was normal for it to hurt.

I feel like I’m doing a GCSE in Love and Relationships as I’ve had to sit down and study this stuff, in order to make sense of it and change my behaviour. I wish schools would teach teenagers about healthy vs unhealthy relationships as I had no idea until I was forced to reconsider everything due to the frightening abusive relationship I had to escape.

I agree with you about being single. I’ve been single for several years and after leaving my ex (and was single a long time before him) and realised how lucky I was to be alive, compounded by reading stories on here of women who are still trying to escape and seeing the statistics of the women who get killed by these men. I knew I couldn’t waste my life and decided that a relationship wasn’t the be all and end all and that I was looking for a man to fix things which never works. I’ve also spent time with much older women in a craft group, most of whom have lost their husbands and they have a nice community where they look out for eachother and care about each other. It’s a calmer atmosphere because unlike younger women, there’s no feeling of competition.

I know I’ve been triggered by this man asking me out. I also know that when I think about my dream future, it does include a man, a very specific man who I’ve never met before. I’m going to continue and build the best life I can for myself and my cat (and more animals I’d like to adopt to add to our family) and I do hope I meet him along the way, I’d be lying if I said I didn’t. Maybe I still have too much of a romantic notion about life, love and men, I don’t know. This is where I’m at today.

What you said also reminded me of how it’s a good idea not to over analyse everything, and go into the body rather than the head all the time. I have a tendency to analyse everything and I do like doing that but I’ve found often the answers just come to me out of the blue, often years later, when analysing things for years didn’t get me there. So I’ll do more body and heart work like yoga, exercise, creative tasks to give myself a rest from all of the analysis. Thank you.

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